OK, I've brought this here because it's not something that I
can find anywhere and deals with the subject of sex in
Paganism/Wicca.
More and more I see people, espically the young who are
claiming to be Pagans and or Wiccans, Witches.
They throw the hand signs and are calling themselves
Wicked Wiccans. And let me tell the pictures I accidently found
in Photobucket under Wiccan are just plain S&M, nothing more.
These are graphics made by psp users and then theres some
pictures of male Wicked Wiccans.
Seems to me that these kids hav'nt gotten the meaning of
Harm none, do as you will, quite right.
Now, I need to address this issue with some folks and the
subject and attitude of sex within the actual Wiccan community.
How do true Pagans and Wiccans view sex?
Understand Im not talking about love, this is about sex, and
seems to be a subject that is very rarely discused.
I think that maybe it's time, and I do need more then my old
Crone wisdom to give these kids.
Thank you.
Blessed Be
Marioam.

I personally believe that sex is between the parties involved. So long as the parties are consenting adults, what they do in their bedroom is their own business.
And BDSM is not about harming a person just to harm them..therefore it does not go against the Harm None rule, imo. There is consent, trust and safe words involved in BDSM relationships. There may be pain but it isn't the same type of pain as say going up and slapping someone randomly. Their minds are in the right moment for it, and erotic pain is totally different from regular pain.

These are just my opinion, and I'm not Wiccan and perhaps I'm not a "true" Pagan if there is such a thing. But, I firmly believe in letting others live their lives as they see fit. When it comes to inviting me into the bedroom with them, well I guess then I will have more to say about what happens and what doesn't.

Oh..and I had not heard of Wicked Wiccans before. I will have to do some research on that.

Just wanted to come back and say that I tried to find out some information about Wicked Wiccans. I found an MSN site that had the title, but not sure if it was this particular group of people mentioned above..or if it was just a name they chose for the site.

What I saw though seemed to be young people that are a) trying to change traditional Wiccan beliefs/sayings and b) not all that accurate on what they believe to be Wiccan ways.
I did see one person say "True Wiccan" and then went on to type a post that wasn't of any Wiccan beliefs I have ever heard of. I just get really irked by the whole "true"/"real"/etc. words. Wicca is not a Christian path and followers of Wicca (and other Pagan paths) do not believe there is a "true" or "only" way out there. Dogma keeps inching its way into Paganism and goes against what the religious/spiritual beliefs are.

Now I know that there are Gardenerian Wiccans who argue that those following Wicca and were not initiated by another Gardenerian are not following the "true Wiccan path". But, then there are others that have a live and let live attitude. That is an argument I stay out of, because I can see both sides of it.
I just personally believe that we all practice the way that it is right for us to practice and we are all heading to the same place in the end..we just have different paths to getting there.

I do hope that the people I saw on the site move on and learn more. If for no other reason than to have knowledge. But, I imagine that once the "cool" factor of being a witch or wiccan wears off a lot of them will move on.
Much like a lot of young people before them that became interested because of Charmed and other movies. They came, they saw, they realized they were completely misinformed and there is actually belief and work done..and life really isn't flashing lights and all that jazz...then they moved on.

Paganism in general is a multi-faceted soical movement, ranging from your high ceremonial covens to fashionable subcultures. Given the Judeo-Chrisitian regulations on sexual behavior, many people view paganism as a means of release from the guilt instilled by their Puritanical roots. The wicked wiccans are one example of this, using the pagan embrace of sex as normal and encouraged as a validation for those behavior for which they would be ostrasized by main stream culture. Of course, there is nothing wrong with this so long as all paarties are "of age" and consenting.

Unfortunantly, many people turn to paganism in order to legitimize behavior shunned by their cultural upbringing. It is of my opinion that if you are simply adopting a system of belief in order to validate your practices, you are obviously still heavily influenced by your original upbringing, thus are lying to yourself about your motivations for partaking in certain practices. Psychologically, you aren't truly changing who you are and what you believe, as you still feel guilt enough to adopt a new system in order to justify yourself.

As is a common theme in Daoism, one must let go of what they are in order to become what one might be. For an individual to truly convert mentally and spiritually, one must accept who they are and be invovled in some sort of event that foundationally changes them. Most of us will never experience such a thing, and it would be foolish to assume every pagan is uninfluenced by there original spiritual upbringing. So to make this incredibly long lecture come to an end, I would say the wicked wiccans are no more or less pagan than most of us, they probably just embrace physical pleasures more than spiritual.

Stacey, that was an absolutely wonderful reply! I couldn't have said it any better myself! Thank you!

Blessings Bright and Dark,

Although my head was spinning jsut a tad by the end of it there Stacey, lol, I agree, very well put.

Although I am not Wiccan, this may help you Marioam:

Sex, in Wicca, is the physical joing of two people and it is a sacred act. Sexuality is considered a gift from the God and Goddess, it is a pleasure and responibility that comes with a physical body.

There are many sexual symbols in Wicca. The sabbats - Wiccans holidays - include stories of the God and Goddess's union. The chalice and athame (ritual knives) on the Wiccan alter represent the reproductive parts of a man and a women. And the focus in Wicca on the cycles of nature emphasizes fertility of both the earth and its people. Gay sex is as much about enjoying our earthly humanity as heterosexual love is, so gay sex is not taboo in Wicca.

Understand the spiritual side of sex frees some people from society's tight constraints about sex. But the idea of sex being sacred also means that is should be treated with reverence, which gives Wiccans a reason to approach sexual relationships with greater care and respect. You are sacred, your body is sacred.

If you are uncomfottable with the idea of sex as sacred or of sexual symbolism, Wicca is probably not for you. The truth is Wicca is a challenge. We cannot and do not change when we are not challenged. Wicca is about change and embracing it. The fact that sex is sacred is only one of the many ways the Wicca might challenge some comonly accepted social norms.

Hope that helps,

Blessings Bright and Dark,